SPEAKER_00 1:19

Hi everyone. Happy Monday. Welcome to another Spicy Spectrum Lie where we gather every Monday at 7 p.m. Eastern Standard Time and we discuss the topic of the week relating to dating, intimacy, and relationships. This week we are tackling a controversial topic. It's been buzzing all over the internet, and I wanted to bring this conversation to this platform. What are your thoughts on transactional relationships? I decided to bring up this topic because I see it all the time. It's popular. And I noticed one thing. I noticed that this display of how to date is very similar to what happens in the adult industry. Very similar, I've noticed, in terms of what goes on behind closed doors. And I'm curious to know your perspective. Now I have my thoughts on this topic, but I also know that other people may have thoughts and opinions that they may be holding. So I like to use this time to dedicate to hearing different perspectives. There's no wrong or right answer. There's only your answer. I how I run this show, if you're new, is that I bring up people one by one. Just write in the chat, hey, I'm interested. I'll bring you up. Please turn off your camera. And it'll be one-on-one. I'll give each person about five minutes or so. And we'll go to the next person. So it's not panel style like the typical lives on here. It's more so called, call in. You come up, you answer the prompt. I may ask um follow-up questions, and we'll bring on the next person. So, and also just uh background about me, I'm Peppercat. I host Spicy Spectrum Live every Monday, like I said. I also have a podcast every Wednesday where I dive deeper into these conversations. So if you'd like to follow through with this conversation and hear more of what I can't always say on here, check out my podcast, Spicy Spectrum. Um, yeah, so just background about me. I worked in I've been working in the adult industry for almost four plus years. And so that's why I wanted to ask this question because I see this question in terms of dating and it matches a lot of what happens in the adult industry and um it kind of mirrors both worlds. So I'm curious to know, um, if anyone's interested to come on stage, tell me your thoughts on your thoughts on transactional relationships. Do you agree? Do you don't? Do you not? If you don't feel comfortable coming up on stage, you can also put it in the comment section and then I'll just read it out loud. And if you just got here, um we just started, but if you want to, if you can't make the whole live, I also will be putting the recording on SubSec and Patreon. So check out the link in my bio to, you know, catch up if you if you miss it. So I'm curious to know your thoughts. Again, it's one by one. This isn't a panel, it's more so someone comes up, then the next person comes up and answer the prompt. And when you request, please turn off your camera. Make sure there's no background noise, especially music, because I will um be sharing this on Patreon and SubSec, and I just don't want that to interfere. So I'm curious to know your answer if you'd like to even write it in the chat. Let me know your thoughts. And who is the first brave soul to come up here and answer the question? Tonight's question is what are your thoughts on transactional relationships? Obviously, this is a popular topic online, and I thought I'd bring this to the forefront before this upcoming Wednesday's podcast episode. So curious to know. What are your thoughts? Put it in the chat. Come up on stage as well. And both men and women are welcome. And there's no right or wrong answer. I just I'm just curious to know your perspective on today's dating scene and even your personal experience with dating. How has it been? Have you done transactional? Have you not? Do you agree? Do you not? I'm curious to know your perspective. If anyone like to come on, just um you may uh to come up on stage. If you follow me and then you say, hey, I'd like to come up, I'll bring you up and give you about five minutes or so to talk. Depending on how many people um uh who else you know would like to join the stage. And that's pretty much it. Uh thank you for coming in. Hi, everyone. I see May. I see Greg. I see I don't want to mispronounce people's names, but thank you all for coming in. I see Christopher Brandon. Right? I don't want to say it wrong. Welcome to Spicy Spectrum Live. We're here every Monday at 7 p.m. Eastern Standard Time. And yeah, feel free to join and say, hey, I like to come up. What are your thoughts? Or write it in the in the chat too. I'll read it out loud. And we will be here until 8 p.m. Eastern Standard Time. So for about an hour. So we have about an hour to join in. Last time we went a little over. But I'm curious to know your thoughts. You'd like to be the first brave soul to come on here. And tell me more about your thoughts about transactional relationships. Do you hear about it? Do you follow content creators who do transactional relationships? Let me know. I have had many experiences. Well, I have had different kinds of dating dynamics. So I'm very familiar. And if you're new here, um, again, I work in an industry where transactional relationships is pretty common. So I do notice um common dynamics between the adult industry and dating. Um and I see it intertwined in dating now, online content. And so I wanted to bring this conversation to the forefront. And just gather your perspective. Um yeah. Yes, so welcome to Spicy Spectrum Live. Who wants to join? Or just write in the chat. You agree? Do you not agree? Yes, no, this. If you have extra thoughts too, I'll bring you up. And you can tell me your perspective. Welcome, welcome everyone. Welcome to Spicy Spectrum Live. I think this is our six live, I believe. I was counting the other ones from last week. And if you were here last live, you can also come back again. So who would like to join on stage? And tell me your thoughts. What are your thoughts on transactional relationships?

SPEAKER_03 8:43

Hmm.

SPEAKER_00 8:44

Do you agree? Do you not? I like to know. Come up on Sage and tell me your spicy perspective. Tell me more about your thoughts. Your perspective on this very, very controversial topic. Hi, hi Michael. Hi. Everyone. And all are welcome. Anyone's welcome to come on. There's no right or wrong answer. Only your answer, only your perspective. So let me know. We're here for about 50 minutes. And I'm curious to know your thoughts. If you like to join, just say hey, I like to join, and then I'll just bring you up. I'm not sure. Actually. Yeah. I think I can. Okay. Who like to come up on stage? Tell me your thoughts. Tell me your tell me your spicy thoughts on this on this spicy conversation. What are your thoughts on transactional relationships? You should also follow me for more relationship content as well. I will be continuing this conversation all throughout this week. So stay tuned for that. But this is the live conversation just to really jump start. Um my point of view as someone who works in the adult industry, and I see the similarities between that industry and as well as like dating content online and how um it is communicated towards those who are looking for dating dating advice. So I have my own opinions, but I like to hear yours too. Your perspectives as well. So if you'd like to come up, just turn off your camera, make sure there's no noise in the background. I'll do one by one and um just say in the chat, hey, I like I'd like to come up and I'll bring you up. Or you can answer the question or the prompt in the chat and I'll read it out loud. So either or whatever you feel comfortable with. You can also send me a private message too if you don't want your username um in public and say, Hey, I'd like you to read, you know, whatever. Um, and I'll read it in my inbox as well. So there's different options to tell me more about your opinion and your thoughts. Shoot me a message right in the comment section or come up on stage. One by one. Anyone interested? You all are shy tonight. You all weren't shy last week. Yes, transactional. Would you like to come up, ward? Thank you for the love. Thank you for the love. Thank you so much. Thank you, thank you. I appreciate the love. Yes, transactional. Any form of transactional money, it can be uh, I don't know intimate, uh intimate transactions, it can be food, fee, any transaction. Um exchange relationships that involve something that is an exchange for it. It can be anything. Would you like to come up? Okay, Mia. I hope I said your name correctly. Mia says, all are not transactional, but definitely conditional. I agree. I agree with that. There's always a condition, even if it's spoken or unspoken. Thank you for your thoughts, Mia. Anyone else? Anyone want to come on stage and expand on your thoughts on transactional? Thank you for the follow, Mia. I appreciate it. Anyone who would like to come up on stage and tell me more about your thoughts on transactional relationships. If you come on, please mute your mic. Or not mute your ready. Turn up your camera. Yeah. And I'll do one by one. And tell me your tell me your spicy thoughts. Uh your thoughts on transactional relationships, which are really common nowadays. You know, I'm sure if you've been scrolling on TikTok or online, you'll see content even dedicated towards transactional dating advice. Or, you know, it's very, it's a very popular topic. And so I thought I'd come on and learn more about your perspective. What are your thoughts on trend transactional relationships? Who like to come up on stage? A lot of shy people this week. We we had a lot of people last week come up come up and share their thoughts. Mia shared. And anyone else, you don't have to come on stage too. You can just type it in the chat as well. Or send me a private message and I'll read it if you don't want your name for for whatever reason to pop up as well. So there are no wrong or right answers, just your answer. I will ask more. I will investigate and and and and follow up to see what you have to say. So, what are your thoughts? Come up on stage. Hi, Sam. Hi, Marie. I hope I'm saying your names correctly. Hi everyone, welcome to Spicy Spectrum Live. We're here every Monday at 7 p.m. Eastern Standard Time. Tonight's question. What are your thoughts on transactional relationships? Would you be in one? Would you participate? Yes, no. Come up on stage, tell me more. I'd love to I'd love to know. I love to know. Hi Anthony. Hi everyone. Make sure to follow to stay tuned for more spicy content. Hi, Polly. Hi everyone. Welcome to Spicy's Fection Live. Feel free to join. Say hey, I like to come up. Yeah. Answer your prompts. What are your thoughts on this type of relationship dynamic? What do you think? What do you think? Welcome to Spicy's Faction Bly. Welcome. You all are so quiet today. So shy. Why are you so shy? Don't be shy. Let me know your thoughts. Hi William. Hi, youth. Forever. Hello, welcome to Spicy Spectrum Live. What are your thoughts on tonight's prompt? Do you agree with transactional relationships? Do you disagree? Would you participate? Would you not? Let me know your thoughts. Come on stage and let me know. I have my thoughts, but which I will be sharing on Wednesday on my podcast. But I want to know your thoughts as well. Huh. Welcome to Spicy's Vectrum Live. Hello. Who else come on? Or I'll just start to like click people's username and then invite you up. But it's no, it's no pressure. No pressure at all. No pressure. And while we wait for someone. Okay, Mia wants to come up. Alright, Mia, I'm going to bring you up. Mia is the first brave soul. Alright, I'm gonna bring you up here. Um hopefully it works. Okay, let me know.

SPEAKER_02 17:43

Oh, I'm I'm not a brave soul. But you know. No, I like I love the topic. I really love it.

SPEAKER_00 17:51

Thank you. What are your thoughts? I know you wrote in the chat, but I'm just curious to know more.

SPEAKER_01 17:58

Yeah, I don't think all relationships are you know transactional. I do think they're conditional.

SPEAKER_02 18:08

In fact, I just had a situation where um I had to uh get rid of a friend, actually, a female friend. Uh because the relationship was not transactional on my end, but it was conditional. Um, and so yeah, I just think most people have terrible boundaries, so they lean into transactional relationships because it's easier.

SPEAKER_00 18:46

And what what kind of conditions are important to you in any sort of relationship that you typically value? I'm just curious.

SPEAKER_02 18:56

Uh for me, I aggressively assert my bodily and intellectual autonomy. And I respect that of other people. Um can I call can I call you pepper? What do you want me to call me pepper? Okay. Okay, so just what I just did there, right? I said, okay, like can I call you this? What do you want me to call you? Um, I respect that. Like if you said no, call me something else, I wouldn't have a problem with that. Um, and so that's my number one boundary. It's like I will tell you everything you need to know about me. But if you overstep the boundary, there is no second chance. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:49

Yeah. Yeah, that's great that you lay out your boundaries and your series about them.

SPEAKER_02 19:54

You know, I don't lay out my boundaries. Like the the way I see it, right, is boundaries are for you. You tell people not your boundaries because because then now you're infringing on how they want to act. I want people to be who they are. So I'm not gonna tell you that um if you are spewing bigotry, then I'm gonna stop being your friend because that gives you the ability to manipulate me and to say, okay, when Maya is around, I'm not gonna say these terrible things because she will stop giving me her labor. She will stop being my friend and doing what I want her to do. Um, and and also, and this is really it's a sad thing to say, but it's true, they're also infringing on their own autonomy because if you're a bigot, you want to be a bigot. And don't let me stop you from being a terrible person. I want terrible people to be who they are. So I don't tell people my boundaries, I tell people my preferences and I tell people about myself.

SPEAKER_00 20:59

Yeah, yeah, I think it's great um what you said when you say you don't tell them, um, because like you said, someone can change their behavior if you tell them, you know, everything that you're looking for, and it's and it's best to kind of observe them and see them and take notes so that they won't change their actions or change their personality and then you don't see the real them, like you said.

SPEAKER_02 21:28

Yeah, I I I never tell people my boundaries, I just tell people about myself. If if we're getting to know each other in any type of relationship platonic, romantic, sexual, anything, um, I'm going to be very direct about um my preferences and what I will or will not do. You know, these these are the things that are hard limits. These are the things that I'm, you know, uh I don't hear either way, and these are the things that I really care about. Um, you know, this is the way that you should uh be, you know, speaking to me. You know, you speak to me in this manner. Right? And it's like, and that's not a boundary, right? Boundaries are boundaries are not about other people's behavior, they're about your behavior. I don't mean to tell anybody, oh, if you punch me in the face, I'm not gonna be your friend. It's like, no, I'm not I'm not doing that. So what you can hide the fact that you want to harm me? No, be who you are, and then I'm gonna leave. And that that's the way I kind of like see all relationships, you know. But sadly, I I just I don't meet enough people who who agree with that. You know, people are more happy, you know, just playing a situation where they feel like they want to gain something from the relationship, and if they're pouring into the relationship as well, nothing else sort of matters. You know, 50-50 in anything, it it it doesn't really exist in reality.

SPEAKER_00 23:09

Yeah. Yeah. No, yeah, yeah, um, that's true. It's not always equal. Like there's always gonna be something um that's gonna going to make any dynamic not always 50-50. Um, and is usually somebody pouring out more or less. Um, and then too, that also goes to someone being compatible with you. Like you said, like if if you see who someone is and you don't like what you see, then that's not the person for you. You know, they may be more compatible with somebody else who may have the same views or um who can handle that as well.

SPEAKER_02 23:50

So okay, can I ask you like what is spicy spectrum?

SPEAKER_00 23:55

Yeah, yeah. So spicy spectrum is a podcast. I've had it for about three plus years, and it's a podcast where I translate what men don't always say out loud. Um, I work in the adult industry, so I bring on guests and experts just to break down sexuality and the human side of those who make content and who purchase it and why people seek out um alternatives in terms of being their true selves that they're doing.

SPEAKER_02 24:25

That is so cool. Like, so I'm a Don. I don't do it. Well you I'm not I'm not a I'm not like necessarily a seller, I'm more of a lifestyle don. That makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 24:36

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, yeah. So I'm uh tell us more.

SPEAKER_02 24:41

Yeah. So for me, I I like the 24-7 lifestyle. Um, I like yeah, I like I I believe men are naturally synthesized. I believe that, you know, most of the issues that women have with men, and and I think about like straight men, um, is that they are sending a lot of mixed signals to men. Like a lot of women will be like, oh, men are like babies. It's like, well, if you think he's like a child, why not treat him like a child? Right? Or move on and go find a man who who is not behaving like a child. And they're like, oh, I have to treat him like a child. I'm like, you're you're actually not treating him like a child. Because with children, we know that if I tell my six-year-old uh son that he can't have something, or if I or if I you know tell him anything he does not like, and he throws a tantrum, what does he receive? He receives a punishment. There are consequences to your behavior. If I say you can't have something because it's for the greater good of be you, and you go and do it anyway, okay, now there is a consequence. We have to take something away. And so a lot of women don't understand that these men, like if you're not willing to take away your body, they will never respect you. Absolutely if you are never willing to say you did something and I'm not mad at you. And and and another thing is that a lot of women are not acting in the men's best interest. And I know that sounds so terrible. People are gonna say, Oh, you're not a feminist, you're not whatever. If you are are are truly acting in another person's best interest because they are your partner, right? You will also be able to give them consequences. But if you are reacting out of anger or frustration or whatever, you you can't be on the moral high ground like a parent would be if they're if they have a bratty teenager. And eventually the teenager will realize, okay, yeah, my mom didn't wasn't making some sense, right? She really did have my best interest at heart. It's like if you don't have the moral high ground and you are acting like a bratty teenager. Well, then there's just two bratty teenagers in a relationship, and except both of you guys are are 30e, which is not a good look.

SPEAKER_00 27:21

Yeah, yeah, and I think too, it also boils down to knowing how to regulate your aim motions as well, you know, um in terms of that dynamic. But yeah, no, I I definitely see um I I do some dom work too. Um, and uh I definitely understand that world as well. And I'm I'm I'm curious um how often we're curious about your niche.

SPEAKER_02 27:48

Because like I want to know about your niche, because like I'm a mommy dom. So like I don't hit people, like I don't hit people. Uh spanking is different, but I don't hit people, I don't degrade people. Um and not saying there's anything wrong with that, I don't kink shame, but that I'm not interested in it because the way I see it is like it's just not in me, it's not a part of my personality. Um, so yeah, I'm I'm a mommy dog. So for me, compatibility is like the thing I know about the most. So when I see women, I see so many women, they're just like, you are actually a mommy dog. And you just don't know.

SPEAKER_00 28:32

No, no, yeah. Uh a lot of people don't know that they're participating in a BDSM relationship. Like they don't they don't recognize like their role that they're playing. You know, they don't so wait, which which which which one are you? So I'm a switch. Most people gravitate gravitate towards me for dom work. For some reason they see me as more dominant, so that's my niche um within my world of domination. I I do mommy dummy. I actually had a mommy dummy call like an hour ago. Um, yeah, so I'm really good at that, you know, like my soft voice, but I'm also like um assertive with some of them. But yeah, yeah, I I do some humiliation. It's not in me to like you said, like to do it naturally, but I'll play around with it from time to time.

SPEAKER_02 29:32

Like, yeah, like like I'm not a sad. Like I like I don't personally do like I don't know if I can say the word, but like the the reg stuff. I I I I'm squeamish. I'm like yeah, I don't, I don't, I'm not in the bat, but you know, to each their own, I don't think shame. But yeah, I I feel like a lot of women, like their frustration with men is because men, a lot of them, not all of them, but a lot of them. Um I don't believe that their psychological needs are changing that much. And this is for for men and women, right? Um, but I do believe in general, men and women have slightly different needs. I think a lot of women have a need for autonomy. This is why you have women and they'll be like, Oh yeah, my husband pays all the bills, he's perfect, he's he's in I saw women with truly amazing husbands, like husbands that work eight hours a day, they come home, they pay all of the bills, and then they also clean the house. Right. And they're also like, hey, babe, what do you want for dinner? I'll cook for you know what I mean? Like women that hit the jackpot, but they're unhappy. They're like, he's amazing, but I'm unhappy because I have to stay here and watch the kids because he has to work, because he pays for everything. And it's like we we have a need inside of us for agency to be self-directed. And I I don't think that's inside of men because men already have that. Like society gives them the ability to step into their agency in a way that it doesn't always give to women, or there are consequences for women. And so I feel like that's one of our needs. And I feel like for a lot of men, they have slightly different needs. I think a lot of men will say, like, oh, I I want you to respect me, and I want you, it's like, but what type of respect? I don't think the average man wants to be respected as a tough guy. I think they the the keyword I always give like my girlfriends when they're having like troubles with their mess. When's the last time you said that you appreciate him? Now, I don't outright tell them to call them a good boy because again, I'm I'm the Don, right? But normal women telling men I appreciate you for little things for for shit that women would do automatically, right? Just for normal shit that most people, you know, like what woman gets praise for working two jobs and raising her kids alone? She doesn't get any praise. Society looks down on her, right? And so, but but men, they need appreciation. And so the dom equivalent of that is literally, oh, you're such a good boy.

SPEAKER_00 32:31

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 32:33

You know, and it it it also yeah, they like it's it's it's the reinforcement, but it's but it's also the intermittent reinforcement. So you can't just do, oh I oh, good boy, good boy, good boy. It's no, there has to be consequences.

SPEAKER_00 32:50

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 32:51

If they don't do even if they don't know that they did something wrong, because like you didn't again, you don't necessarily want to give them the boundaries, you want to see what are you gonna do naturally, and you will be punished for doing certain things, but I'm not mad at you. Now you know what to do. And then he comes back, oh good boy. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 33:16

Exactly. I wish um more people knew about BDSM because I think it does um it does show us um a different way of having relationships with people. And you know, people don't necessarily have to pick and choose a role, but if they understand even the language of how to speak with someone else, and um especially men, I feel like more women will would understand um men and um vice versa, you know. And we learn more about our selves too. Like I know when I first did it, did Dom work, I learned more uh about myself, about human nature. Um but yeah, yeah, that's um actually cool that you lived a lifestyle.

SPEAKER_02 34:06

Yeah, I I started out I started out doing Dom work, like actual work, and then it just laid into the lifestyle because I I literally I started in my like um in my like almost my mid-30s. I'm not quite there. But I started in like my mid-20s. And I was like, people can make money from those? This is awesome. Like it is, yeah. And this was like this was like like right at like lockdown with COVID.

SPEAKER_00 34:41

Got it.

SPEAKER_02 34:42

And I and and like I was introduced to people that I had never like met before because we were all online, like, and like almost like forced to like congregate, like be together. I'm like, oh, what's what's going on over there? What's happening over here? Um, and I I had met some Doms and I was like, this this is like so interesting, and so yeah, I did that for a little while, and then eventually I was just like, I I like this as a lifestyle. Like I yeah, like I I like having a son. I like I like the relationship with men for me can never be that he's dominant. Um, because for me, there's no respect there. I I don't respect dominance in men, so it would be unfair for me to even enter into that relationship. Um, because I I don't respect dominance in men, I only respect submission because I feel like for most men, that is their true nature. You know, when you look at what men naturally gravitate towards, and we can even use like the military as an example, they willingly sign up, like when there's no war going on, you are willingly signing up to follow orders of typically men that are probably bigger and stronger than you. Let like think about like what do they call them? The drill sergeants, big muscles, intimidating dudes, yelling at you. You're signing up for this. You're signing up to always have some commanding officer above you who, if anything shitty happens to you, you know, do anything shitty, you have to answer to them. You have to answer to a higher authority. Men do this naturally, they willingly do this. And so the way I look at it is like that for me, that is the epitome of manhood. I don't want to be with a man who who is not attracted to that, who is not attracted to order and following directions and being obedient and you know, understanding rules. Like all of these are amazing traits in a human being.

SPEAKER_00 37:28

Yeah, I um I agree. I do agree. Like, um, you know, part of what what shocked me about working in this industry were the amount of men who wanted to serve and who took pleasure in that. Um, and a lot of what I noticed is that they didn't have that persona in their real life, but when they come into certain spaces, it's almost like they're relieved to be in the serving role. Um, so that's what I found, you know. But yeah, no, that's um true. And I I'm curious to know your thoughts because I notice um when it comes to dating, I what I see are a lot of common trends between dating advice for transactional relationships in the BDSM community slash the adult industry. And I wanted to know your thoughts on that and how people use dating um content that mirrors more of the BSM.

SPEAKER_02 38:35

I think that content is incredibly dangerous to women because what these women are not being told is that all of these concepts are coming from S-workers. And I know this because I was a S-worker. So it's like when you have women who are thinking you know what it is? It it's the fairy tale of I can just look pretty and people give me money. If you ask models, normal models, runway models, right? Is your job does your job just consist is just consisting of you walking down runways and men taking pictures of you and not expecting anything from you? They'll tell you, no, they're creepy. I don't like being left alone with certain photographers because I've half like they will all tell you, no, I don't know a single girl. For me, I have tons of girlfriends that are models. I don't know a single girl in the industry, in the entertainment industry in general, music, film, television, they have all either directly been affected or they've all witnessed something happen to another woman where there are expectations. But the rest of the world, especially women, they think, oh, it must be so great. Oh, I wish, you know, that I was, you know, Zadea. I wish that I was this girl. I wish that, you know. And then what happens with this content is that they make that fantasy a reality. Well, you could be just like these girls where men shower you with gifts and you have to do nothing. It's like, no, we've seen Kiki Palmer talk about being almost essayed, right? At a with with traceons. Like, like we've seen so many of these women come out and say, like, no, I work for everything I've had. And I, and and these people that are giving me things expect something out of me. There is no there, there's no such thing as uh a free lunch, you know, when it comes to women. Um, and so these content creators, they're creating this content, they don't even know the source of the content. The source is Shira Seven, which these people are literally, they're literally stealing content and phrases um from a Afro-Latino woman who says in every one of her lives that she does not give relationship advice, she gives advice to get money out of men. So she's very clear that if you want to settle down with men, with with a wealthy man, here is how you do that. She is also clear when she gives advice to women who are not ready for that. She's like, if you're young and you're cute, you just want money, here's how you get it. What's happening is that you have Shira Seven, who is not a she's not a feminist. Um and she's also not a massandrist. They think she is. Um and you have feminists that will take her language and will take these concepts that are very much SW worker coded and try to fit them in a box where it's easily digestible to non-S workers.

SPEAKER_00 41:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 41:59

Um, and that's dangerous.

SPEAKER_00 42:01

It is, it's very dangerous because even when I scroll through the content, I'm like, this sounds like what I do. Like, and the like there are predators who will take advantage of women trying this out. There are protocols that you need to know when you do, you know, that kind of dating. Um, there's dangers, like you said, there's kinks and fetishes that you may not know about that may be in exchange for the money that you're getting. Like it's just so much. Um, and it's so public where everyone can see it, and you just don't know who's watching it and trying it out by themselves.

SPEAKER_02 42:39

And um they're they're teaching these girls things that number one, they've never in their life done. So you have girls who've never been S-workers and and they're posting content using the language of S-workers, using the language of you know, DDSM, DS Dynamics, whatever it is. And because they've never done it, they don't understand what they're in. And they also don't understand something that a lot of us don't talk about in the community, which is we don't talk a lot about vetting because exactly. And and and we're not doing it maliciously. It's just because it is sometimes it's very difficult, depending on what you do. Um, sometimes that that's the deal breaker. It's literally something that is quite frustrating when you're trying to vet a person for your safety. Um, and now you are missing out on money or you're you've wasted your time because this person is refusing to cooperate for your safety. It's not just you, you're telling him what to do and he's not, it's like, no, this is my safety. And so a lot of us don't the reason we don't speak about vetting um is is also because if you speak about it online and you're making videos about it, men are seeing these videos. And it creates danger for other S workers, exactly. Because they know how to maneuver, they know how to manipulate the system, and exactly and so non-s workers talking about these they freestyling. What are you? I'm like, you're a 22-year-old girl who just graduated college. You're talking about freestyling at a bar?

SPEAKER_00 44:21

That's dangerous.

SPEAKER_02 44:22

So it's so dangerous, it's dangerous, and like this isn't the way you get kicked out of ho trespassed.

SPEAKER_00 44:30

Yes, and they're listening about what we're you know, saying like you can get the police called on you.

SPEAKER_02 44:37

You can get the police called on you, you can get trespassed, you can you can get banned from places, and it's just like the reason the reason they don't include vetting uh as a part of the process is because they're not in community with S workers, they're not in our community, so they don't know about it.

SPEAKER_00 44:55

Exactly. And you know, one of the problems I have too about those platforms is that a lot of times they'll put down from what I've seen, they'll put down S workers or OF women. And I'm like, wait, you're teaching the same thing that that content came from the world of the same women that you're putting down. Like I've seen, you know, clips. And even, you know, Shira Seven, I saw her talk about OF women, and I'm like, wait, like that's the world, you know, what what you're teaching is the world where that kind of lifestyle came from, you know. So but um, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 45:34

It's getting Shira Seven is such an interesting person. The problem with Shira Seven is that she still has Shira Seven is not a misandrist. And when I say misandrist, so for me, I don't believe misandry is simply the hatred of men. What I believe is misandry is actually uh viewing men as they actually are. So if you are a male and you're behaving badly, I'm going to treat you like what you are being. You don't, you don't get any leeway because women don't get leeway in society. You know, the way that men treat women generally in society, it's functionally misogynistic. They don't have to walk up to every woman and call them stupid. Right. But when they walk into, you know, when they go and hang out with their friends and they're like, yeah, my wife's nagging me and she's it's like the the misogyny is there. And it's working systemically. So he doesn't have to tell his wife she's a dumb bitch because it's I'm sorry. No, it's implied. It's implied when he goes and talks to his they're see, he doesn't have to say it because they're thinking it. His friends are thinking it. Oh yeah, your wife's doing that weird ish again. She's doing it. It's like it's it's it's truly systemic. It's it's it's a part of that. And so that's how I that's personally how I view men. It's like we we know that we know about the male psyche. Um, we know that because of the patriarchy, men have also been displaced where they cannot actually lean into what is natural to them um in their everyday normal lives. You know, I think it's terrible that men have to join the military and give up their bodily autonomy and agency just as an excuse to be yelled at. Because society will tell them if you want your woman to spank you and to punish you and to and like a drill star to tell you to get over there and and do 10 push-ups, that something is wrong with you. I think that's terrible. But like, you know what I mean? So for me, Missandry is really just understanding that the patriarchy has caused men to harm everyone, including themselves. And I'm unwilling to coddle them. And so the problem with Shira Sen is that she makes it seem like she's a Miss Sandry. She's not one because you stay with a man that has physically harmed you. A lot of people don't know this about her, um, and her husband, her late husband. Um, you've stayed with him because of money, and again, she's not gonna see that as a SW situation, because in her mind, well, I've married him and I've had children. It's like, well, yeah, but it's a transactional relationship. Um, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 49:17

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, yeah, those um transactional conversations are really interesting too because like you said, like the people too who are making the content, they're not what they present is always not what's happening behind closed doors, too. So that's another thing.

SPEAKER_02 49:37

I'm sorry, you're just like so gorgeous. I don't know why, but like women in any, you know, in DS space, they're always so gorgeous. Like I I I love I love dominant women, and I I've had to tell people, I'm like, dominant does not mean that you're gonna be mean. Um, yeah, I love I mean unless you're paying me for it. Right.

SPEAKER_00 50:06

I like if you want to curse somebody else, which I I like to curse people else from time to time when I need to, you know, push out my energy towards something else that's consensual, you know, if that's what they want. Yeah.

unknown 50:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:22

But yeah, I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_02 50:24

Have you like tried um I don't know, like have you tried lifestyle or what?

SPEAKER_00 50:29

I've tried lifestyle a little bit within certain relationships. I do enjoy being dominant, I'm not gonna lie. Like like you, I like I love when men want to serve and be helpful too in my personal life. So I do I do want to dive more into that. Um, but like I I guess because I do adult work, like I try to kind of have a happy balance within my normal life too, you know, because it is a lot to have to balance um the adult world versus my world and kind of just having a healthy balance that works for me so I won't be bogged down by too many um dynamics that I have to juggle. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 51:14

Yeah, I I definitely understand that. And I think for me, where I met in the middle was just like, okay, I have financial I have financial expectations for my subs. Good. You know what I mean? And it's like for me, that that was my middle ground. Um yeah, that would that was the middle ground for me.

SPEAKER_00 51:44

Yeah. Do you have do you mind sharing what kind of um ways that your subs service you well without like breaking the rule of your TikTok? Um, how they service you um just like a day in a life of what that looks like for you.

SPEAKER_02 52:03

Honestly, for me, the duties of my sub are are very simple. So, number one, I don't believe in like lazy men. I require my subs. Um, I require them to work at least eight hours a day. Um, and two of those hours can be actually working out if they want to, like if they're jumbuffs or whatever. Um, like I've I've I've had subs and like they're entrepreneurs, and so they don't really have day jobs. You know, they show up and they have the boss and they're I've had bad experience experiences with that. Um, I'm I'm more interested in a sub that makes less money, but he's working every day. He's doing something with his body, with his life, with his mind. Um, yeah, like in my opinion, a lot of men what I call fake subs, a lot of them are entrepreneurs. A lot of them, they have a lot of money. They don't again, again, they're they're like princesses, they don't they don't really work that much. You know, they just show up, you know, they're the boss that just shows up because I'm just making sure everything is good, you know? And so, and so they're very dominant in their everyday life, and that seeps into the private life. I don't want that. I want a man that works a normal job, like give me the man that's a CPA, right? And he's stressed out, he has a boss he hates. Like, give me, give me that, because he again, he's used to being dominated, and so he's he's used to being harshly dominated, and so by the time he's home with me, he's like, Oh, this is heaven, versus a man who's like an entrepreneur doesn't really work. He sleeps in till 4 p.m. and then goes to the gym and sits in the sauna, and uh you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, and that so his life is already soft. So, so any soft, so when when I come, I'm actually in comparison, I'm not soft, I'm harsh because his whole life is soft. I don't like those men. Like you gotta do, you gotta do something. You can't be sleeping in full four, uh-uh, you're a man.

SPEAKER_03 54:29

Right.

SPEAKER_00 54:31

Yeah, no, yeah, that's that's pretty cool just to hear your point of view. Um, I have a lot of Dom friends, um, and they all have different dynamics. I know some have men who clean up for them, you know, some have men who do all kinds of things to um serve.

SPEAKER_02 54:48

I I I I mean I think it depends on like I think it just depends on like what can be afforded because for me I like my man to be more of a servant.

SPEAKER_00 55:00

Yeah, I like that too.

SPEAKER_02 55:03

Yeah, because that that that's what I like. And when it comes to like cleaning and things like that, I've always had a cleaner. I'm like, I don't need you to clean, I need you to get naked and like kiss my feet. Like, I don't need you preoccupied with laundry.

SPEAKER_01 55:23

Interesting.

SPEAKER_02 55:25

Or like it's it's 3 a.m. go drive to like you know, the nearest like Krispy Kreme, which is like 40 minutes away, and go get me a donut. Like, like I need these men to do things that I can't ask a domestic worker to do.

SPEAKER_00 55:42

Right.

SPEAKER_02 55:43

You know what I mean? Like that's abuse. Like you, like, like I hired you to clean my house and I can't I can't ask you to go drive 40 minutes to Krispy Green. Right. Like that's a little that's a little weird. So I need them to do that stuff. I need, you know, if I have company over, um, I need him to say, like, okay, you know, I'm gonna leave because I don't want to make you ladies uncomfortable, but do you need any refreshment? And then he goes and makes tea for the girls and then he gets the fuck out of our babes.

SPEAKER_00 56:11

Yes, you know what I mean? Like I love that. No, yeah, like I've actually had that with my down friends. Well, where like they'll like have him in the kitchen like cooking for us and you know, bringing us cheese and wine, and like, oh wow, I like this.

SPEAKER_02 56:24

Oh yes, and like you know, I I like men of color, and so they they always know how to cook.

SPEAKER_00 56:34

Smart they can all they can always throw together something. I didn't even think about that. Now you have me thinking, like, I need to I need to give me a slave.

SPEAKER_01 56:49

Did it wrong?

SPEAKER_00 56:50

I need one in person.

SPEAKER_02 56:52

Oh, okay. And and and that's another thing. I I I love in person dynamics. I for me I hate the like usually there's a period of time where it is online. I hate that period. I hate it with my soul. I hate it.

SPEAKER_00 57:13

Yeah, it's very challenging. Like, it's all different kind of people who, you know, like you said, fake subs, you don't know who's real.

SPEAKER_02 57:24

Yeah, it's exactly fake subs, like the these, and I constant I'm constantly contacted by like these like dominant men. Like it'll even still say on their profile that they're dumb. And they're like, I was, you know, I just want to submit to like the right woman, like I could submit. And I'm like, get out of my face. And if I'm not attracted to you, like you want a submissive woman, like like you want to top a dom. That doesn't no, it's not gonna happen.

SPEAKER_00 57:51

Right, right. They want to conquer you too. Like, yeah, like I've I've I've had that too, like where they'll like call my Dom line. And I'm like, Why are you calling this line?

SPEAKER_02 58:00

But they want like the power dynamic to shift, you know, and yeah, they they they want to be, and and like this, I feel like this is the other side of the coin of the women who are like, Oh, they're children, but then they don't treat them like children. These men will say like they want this type of like di, you know, whether it's like mommy, don't, you know, whatever, like I I want this type of dynamic. It's like, but they don't respect the authority that you have. Mothers have authority, right? Mothers have authority, and like you are a fully grown boy. There's a point in growth where you can't whoop your kids, they are taller than you. So if you think I am going to be aggressive with you and do all this, like it sounds to me like you want um a dominatrix. It sounds to me like you want a someone who potentially is a sadist, um, and who is willing to not just tie you up, but to also um, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 59:12

Like I know what you mean.

SPEAKER_02 59:15

Like punish you in these very physical ways. It's like, oh, what are you gonna do? Make me do something. It's like, Dave, I think you contact the wrong person.

SPEAKER_00 59:24

Right. Yeah, and like that's another thing too. Like they'll con right, right, they'll like contact you and then they'll want you to do what they want you to do, and that's not your niche. Um, I've had guys who are like pushy, you know, trying to, you know, have me be someone who I'm not or like what I don't offer. So but yeah, thank you. Thank you um so much for coming on. And I love that I had Adam come up here. So I mean that's um pretty cool to hear your perspective because I do think your perspective pairs well with tonight's question. Um, and so I really appreciate hearing more. And um thank you. Thank you for coming on, Maya. Thank you so much, and I can't I can't wait to see more of your of your lives. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thanks for joining me. And I'm gonna bring you down. I don't know how this title moved, like it's like on my face, and I I had it for some reason, I don't know what happened, but it's just now I have to move things around. But yeah, so I hope you all enjoyed this conversation. Um, I'm so glad that we had a chance to hear Maya's perspective and um my thoughts to wrap it up because I do hold on, I'm just gonna because this is so annoying. Let me just move this because I don't know how this moved, but we're gonna move this really quickly. All right. So I did share my thoughts on this, but I'll share it again. I'm totally fine with whatever people choose to do with their lives. I can't I can't tell you what to do. I will say that especially when it comes to transactional advice, and this is coming from someone who works in the adult industry, and there are a lot of similarities between both worlds to be careful who you consume and to always do your research. Um, I would advise not just jumping into something and listening and just jumping and not doing your own research because it is, it can be dangerous. You know, I'm people can do what they're do what they want, but always um be cautious of who's the messenger and what they're telling you. So those are my thoughts. I'm I'm actually going to expand on my substack tomorrow, on my what he's thinking substack, where I translate what men don't say out loud. Check me out. I have a link in my bio, and then I have a podcast that's dropped that's dropping on Wednesday. Certain things I can't say here, but I'm going to say it on my podcast. And so I hope you join me next week. We're here every Monday at 7 p.m. Eastern Standard Time. Make sure to follow me to get more updates. And if you miss today's live, it will be on Substack and Patreon. Again, the link in my bio, spicyspectrum.com, will let you know how to find the recording. So thank you so much. I appreciate everyone's perspective. And I just want to read the comments. I know um some of you wrote a couple of things. I know Kevin said, I know when we were talking about transactional relationships um and the dangers that come with it, he named Cassie. Um I see your comment. And then somebody else, Daily Music, said this is a very, very interesting topic. So thank you so much for participating in the chat, coming up on stage, keeping the conversation respectful but real. Okay. And I will see you until next time. Thank you so much. I love these kind of conversations, and I love um just sharing a new perspective. And I hope you walked away with the new perspective. And as always, I'll see you again and stay tuned for more spicy conversations. Have a wonderful week.

unknown 1:03:16

Bye.